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Old 04-03-2018, 11:09 AM   #21
redtiger7
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Gotta agree with the others. I find the roles, as implimented, are a bit restricting. Overall, my current forwards are pretty balanced between offence and defence ratings, but I can't have 3 scoring lines without abandoning defence entierly, it seems. I'll have 3 really good two way left wingers, but when I put one on the 3rd line, his role numbers suffer. It's like he's not even allowed to do his thing.

Tactics are a bit hard to figure out and it seems like it's just what roles will be availabel to what lines. (Tactic A has 2 playmakers on the first line. Tactic B has playmaker, score and two way forward.) Not to mention that some roles don't seem that different from each other. (What's the difference between a playmaker and a set-up man?)
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Old 04-03-2018, 11:16 AM   #22
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If you opt GM only, I'm presuming the head coach will deal with the assigned roles, but I like to select the lines and other stuff.
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Old 04-03-2018, 11:20 PM   #23
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In this particular term I like more EHM, I would like to assing another kind of roles.
Hit more, hit less, shoot more, pass more, playmaker, etc.

But these roles in particular affect the game direct and inderectly.
Sometimes if I compare the teams mine is way behind the others and we win and sometimes likes we are going to win easily and we get crushed by 7 goals so when those roles are working and where are not working? I have no idea.

One of my 4th line players has 14 goals so far, 3rd with more goals in my team and his roles are all defensive so, I don't know. I'm pretty much lost in terms of roles.

If they could remove this or fix it to something more easier to understand and enjoyable like increasing the percentage of shooting changes or passes like EHM would be more easy and helpful.
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Old 04-04-2018, 05:57 AM   #24
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Having played both games, I have to agree. It still isn't something that FHM has quite got right.
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Old 04-04-2018, 01:35 PM   #25
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On a similar note, what to do when a line just sucks? Whatever I do, my second line ends with something ranging from -1 to -5. I tried shuffling lines, changing roles, changing defensive roles, being patient, nothing to do. Nothing. My second line just doesn't score and just allows goals like I play with no netminders. I am with the Avs.
In first year I had Andrighetto-Jost-Yakupov-Zadorov-Girard. Girard ended with -59.

This year I have Landeskog-Jost-Dadonov-Zadorov-Johnson. Currently playing with Flexible Triangle/Midlane backchek.I tried swapping Jost with Kerfoot, swapping Dadonov with Rick Nash (i regret the 6 millions I spent on him). Roles are Up and down winger/Playmaker/Speedy Forward/Stay-at-home/Mobile on offense and Backchecking/Two-way/Counterattacking/Stay-at-home-Two-Way.
I also tried moving Landeskog up and playing Kubalik or Compher on the second line. Nothing. The only player who scored a 5-on-5 goal is Landeskog. Jost netted a couple from the third line, Dadonov never scored, Nash scored on the PP, Kerfoot never scored.
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Old 04-04-2018, 01:58 PM   #26
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Scratch the roles. Please.
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Old 04-04-2018, 08:14 PM   #27
maikgianino
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alessandro View Post
On a similar note, what to do when a line just sucks? Whatever I do, my second line ends with something ranging from -1 to -5. I tried shuffling lines, changing roles, changing defensive roles, being patient, nothing to do. Nothing. My second line just doesn't score and just allows goals like I play with no netminders. I am with the Avs.
In first year I had Andrighetto-Jost-Yakupov-Zadorov-Girard. Girard ended with -59.

This year I have Landeskog-Jost-Dadonov-Zadorov-Johnson. Currently playing with Flexible Triangle/Midlane backchek.I tried swapping Jost with Kerfoot, swapping Dadonov with Rick Nash (i regret the 6 millions I spent on him). Roles are Up and down winger/Playmaker/Speedy Forward/Stay-at-home/Mobile on offense and Backchecking/Two-way/Counterattacking/Stay-at-home-Two-Way.
I also tried moving Landeskog up and playing Kubalik or Compher on the second line. Nothing. The only player who scored a 5-on-5 goal is Landeskog. Jost netted a couple from the third line, Dadonov never scored, Nash scored on the PP, Kerfoot never scored.
I know what you feel. I have the same problem with my 4th line and 3rd defense line. No matter what player is there their roles are 1/1 and they are terrible like they are pretty bad players but they are decent players with at least 3 stars.

I just don't get it.
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Old 04-08-2018, 12:34 AM   #28
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I think that the interface needs some work, but the system itself definitely should not be scratched. Just don't put too much emphasis on the roles, is all.

It would be nice to see the exact effects of role bonuses and penalties better. I really like the addition of strategy suitability... adding a way to search for players suited to specific roles would help tremendously.

I don't know, I just (strongly) disagree that the strategy and roles system should be scrapped. It just needs a bit more work, is all. I'd love the ability to customize my own strategy system, though.
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Old 04-08-2018, 12:55 AM   #29
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I just think decent individual instructions for each player would be a much better way and at the same time determine the role for the player. But if it's not scratched, I agree with you that at least customization is a must. You should have the option to make your own tactics and not just stick to the predetermined ones.
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Old 04-08-2018, 01:42 AM   #30
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Maybe just reduce the number or roles to make them more accurate and easy to understand for everyone?

Like for forwards: Playmaker, Sniper, Power Forward, 2 Way Forward, Defensive Forward and for defencemen, Stay At Home, Offensive, Defensive, 2 way defenceman.

Things things like Gooner, speedy, aggresive, Gretzky, grinder... I don't know I just want them to defend and attack haha. :P
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Old 06-18-2018, 09:36 AM   #31
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I'm going back to FHM4 for a second attempt as the constant fiddling with the roles put me off the game. Perhaps a reduction would be better in next year's game.
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Old 06-25-2018, 12:58 PM   #32
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I like the concept of roles but feel like it'd be better served as an individual basis with maybe a more simplified: Offense/Defense/2 Way concept for the actual lines themselves.

This way you can set individual players to roles that may suit their ratings e.g. Ovechkin as a Shooter vs. Crosby as a Playmaker vs. Bergeron as a 2 Way Forward while assigning the lines they're on to focus more on a general tactic e.g. favoring offense/being aggressive and taking shots, favoring defense/neutralizing opponents, and a two way where it's more emphasis on puck turnover and slight defense.

To take it a step further, I wouldn't be opposed to a slider for each line of 100-0 with 100 being extreme offense and 0 being extreme defense. This way, users can decide how offensive/defensive they want each individual line to be overall e.g. maybe I want Line 1 to be around 72% Offense but Line 2 is more balanced so maybe 54% Offense and Line 3 is 40% Offense.

Last edited by DawnBTVS; 06-25-2018 at 01:09 PM.
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Old 07-10-2018, 01:18 AM   #33
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I actually like the overall tactics and individual role systems. Once you get it, your team will perform much better in games and usually gain the tactical advantage if you have the right players and roles chosen.

However, the problem is that once I choose the most suitable tactics and then get the highest tactical score that I can, I then have to make dozens of adjustments once the game starts so I can gain the tactical advantage by maximizing the number of countering roles while losing the least amount of my own tactical score.

Once I find this balance, I usually succeed, but the problem is I have to go through this every time I enter a game. I'm sure the developers know it by now, but there has to be a way to save your different lineups and tactics so you don't have to adjust them at the start of each game. Especially because you play a lot of the same teams and their overall tactics don't really change. Especially in a league like the SPHL where you play the same team two nights in a row.

I also play a lot of EHM and I have to admit I like the tactical system in FHM 4 better. EHM is easier because you can pick 18 players and set them all to maximum offense, however, I don't find this realistic at all. What I do like is that you can save your different lineups and tactics (and lock players in place and have the AI choose the rest) but there's really no way to tell if your tactics are having an effect during the game. Also, again you can load your 3rd and 4th lines with goalscorers, which would never happen in real hockey.

To sum up, I like where the tactics and role system is going and I hope it doesn't get scratched. It just needs refinement, especially the ability to save things. I would be very disappointed if FHM 5 doesn't have this.
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Old 07-10-2018, 10:54 AM   #34
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You can load your 3rd line with goal scorers, but you can only give them defensive roles. And loading your 4th line results in a bunch of unoptimized ratings. (1/3, 1/4, etc...)
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Old 07-10-2018, 04:57 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redtiger7 View Post
You can load your 3rd line with goal scorers, but you can only give them defensive roles. And loading your 4th line results in a bunch of unoptimized ratings. (1/3, 1/4, etc...)
It's not that you are restricted from putting goal scorers on your third line, it's that it's not optimal. You are much better off putting defense oriented players in these defensive roles. For example, a strong defensive center who is given the shadow role. Especially, if you decide to match your third line with the opposition's first line.

As far as the fourth line goes, I'm not exactly sure why the developers didn't limit the various roles that can be used. All I can think of is that you could choose to use just three lines or four sets of defensemen. Also, in a league like the SPHL, you can only dress 18 players so that leaves an extra forward or defensemen. So basically, they left that last line of offense and defense out of the overall tactics.
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Old 07-11-2018, 11:33 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pax25 View Post
It's not that you are restricted from putting goal scorers on your third line, it's that it's not optimal. You are much better off putting defense oriented players in these defensive roles. For example, a strong defensive center who is given the shadow role. Especially, if you decide to match your third line with the opposition's first line.
Yes, you can puyt in players who are good at scoring goals, but you can't give them any goal scoring role. The only tactics available that I've seen have all been defensive (aside from Grinder)
It's the old John Kordic story. Guy's big, so he's told not to score goals, just go out and hit people. Happens all the time, so not really surprising it's doable in FHM. What's annoying is that you can't not do it. You have no option to tell that player to go score goals.

Last edited by redtiger7; 07-11-2018 at 11:35 AM.
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Old 07-11-2018, 11:53 AM   #37
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I wonder if we can set the lines ourselves and assign the coach to set up the ideal tactical roles. Does anyone know?

When I sim the games (without actually watching them), does the coach automatically take care of the in-game adjustments?
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Old 07-11-2018, 12:35 PM   #38
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Right at the moment we work on changes to the tactical system in FHM 5. After we read all the feedback (good and bad) and question (seems that many concepts are just not really clear right now) we worked out a concept that takes the good from the current system (mainly roles) and combines it with new ways to handle tactics in the game. Our main goal was to make the system easier/faster to work with, more intuitive, give the user much more freedom and also more to do before/during a game.

I┤m very happy how it evolves at the moment and hope we find the time to work out everything in time for the release.
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